VP debate thread

How many times did Ryan take a drink?  Did Martha do a better job than the so-called "Dean of Moderators"? Was the religion question just stoopid to be asked considering seperations of church and state?   Discuss...

Comments

[KS blathers]

Martha SUCKED big time as the moderator. She refused to get out of the way and hurt the debate - too many foreign policy questions.

Biden interrupted 82 times and Ryan only 6 times. CNN had Ryan ahead 56% - 36%. Interesting... The viewers must have not cared for his laughing, acting like a pompous a$$ and his demagoguery. Funny how that is.. Ryan started out rather weak but got stronger as it went along and toward the end.

[Finis Hominis]

Biden interrupted 82 times and Ryan only 6 times.
Posted by: KS blathers | October 11, 2012 at 07:56 PM

That’s because Ryan lied so much.
Biden busted the neocon crazy train.

[Hal's Bitch]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH KS! Martha was a MEANIE, huh? Too Many Questions about Foreign Policy?? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA because your guy HAS NO FOREIGN POLICY!!!

Joe kicked his ass. I hope Ryan had a catheter for all that water he drank.

[Preston]

Foreign policy questions hurt Ryan, he has no experience plus this is Martha's field of expertise.

[Big Bird!]

Yeah, she was so biased... to start the debate with a RW-based question designed to make Biden stumble.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

it's official. Joe Biden is a buffoon. cnn is announcing 48/45 ryan with registered voters. i will take that as a slim victory for Ryan, not a tie.

[Marc]

A Romney/Ryan administration will not separate faith from policy. They will oppose a woman's right to make her own decisions and leave it to the politicians.

They lost the election right then and there.

How I know Biden won? The right is bitching about the moderator.

[Preston]

CBS says 50 Biden/31 Ryan. I thought CNN was on your socialist media list, Thomas?

[Hedge Fund Hal]

you're living in a time warp Marc. A modest majority of women in America are now pro life, so this issue will be at be s a wash.

[Hal's Bitch]

There's a double standard on CNN sweetie.
When Romney interrupted Obama, it was characterized as "strong." When Biden interrupted Ryan, now, suddenly, it's "rude."

[Hedge Fund Hal]

all that was missing with Joe's performance was the big red nose and the clown suit.

[Preston]

But if he had dressed as a clown, it would of been child abuse, considering the ass whooping Ryan got.

[sparky]

CNN's "poll" of "registered voters"
claims a "tie" with Ryan 48% to Biden 44%. But, the polls on their Facebook page show Biden beat the tar out of Ryan.

Best comment of the night...from Bill Maher.. "Hello, 911? There is a man whipping a child on my tv!"

[Hedge Fund Hal]

Ryan did what he needed to do. He had at least the gravitas of Bidedn, iwould say more, and at worst battled to him a draw ( i would say a modest victory). The social media is really picking up on the buffoon / rude clown performance of Biden. Lokk for SNL to reduce the man to a Gerald Ford-like goober and jackass come the weekend when they do hteir parody of the veep debate.

[T-S]

I agree. Martha did a very good job although she didn't have a twitching out-of-control Romney to deal with.

What I noticed was that Biden pretty much stuck to issues while I heard quite a few slimy talking points from Ryan. It was as if he had a list he had to get through. Of course, talking points work to the herds that need them. Ryan was scripted; Joe was real.

I do wish he hadn't laughed so much at the beginning. He was patient but responded with body language (laughing) which did seem sort of superior. When Joe finally got his teeth into Ryan, he was much more effective. Thank you Biden.

What I don't understand is why Biden didn't confront Ryan more often on the lack of cooperation on the right. He did get in the comment about pledges to Grover but he should have pointed out a less-known fact about the decision on inauguration night to stand in the way of everything Obama. Every time Ryan claimed Obama promised something that he didn't deliver, Biden could have reminded him of the plan Ryan himself was part of. That's a no brainer to me.

Finally, Martha did a great job pressing Ryan and Romney on their budget and the numbers or should I say bad math.

Biden really took it to Ryan on the war and the part the joint chiefs played in the decision. Jeez, Ryan tried so much truthiness and Martha caught a lot of it.

It was a good debate. I wonder if it changed anybody's mind?

[Hedge Fund Hal]

Biden, on the ohter hand, did not do what he needed to do. CNN is spinning it, but what Biden and Obama needed was a clear win. He didnt get it . hahaT-S

[ExPattBrit]

Normally the VP debate result probably wouldn't matter but I suspect because the republicans made a big deal of this debate and predicted that that Ryan would squash Biden maybe many more people watched it.

My Republican boss predicted it also, he is going to be pissed and will no doubt blame the moderator also.

"Age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill".

[T-S]

And every time he could have pointed out the rightwing obstruction, Biden could have looked into the TV set and asked for a more liberal congress to save social security and medicare. Now that would have been really effective.

[T-S]

Sorry, one more: (I'm rewatching it) Biden sounds like he understands what he is saying. He's been there. It's natural. Ryan sounds scripted. That's all I can say.

[Preston]

Actually, I thought Biden did look at the camera and ask the public if this is what they wanted.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

Ryan didn't need to squash Biden. He looked Presidential. no one can say Biden did. Apparently Joe didn't know about that new-fangled splitscreen technology. Romney needed a clear win. Didn't get er done. Obama was not pleased to see his man mugging and grinning like a chimpanzee.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

should read- "Biden needed a clear win"......

[T-S]

Keep trying, H-T-D. Maybe you'll find a few who agree.

Preston, I do think he did. I just wanted more.

Did anyone else notice how often Ryan swallowed his adams apple? He is always a polished speaker but was stiffer tonight than I've seen him before. Also, I just heard Martha stop Ryan in his platitudinous monologue and ask him "but how are you going to do it?"

Perhaps we should all watch debates twice. The first time we are cheerleading for our own side. The second time we're actually seeing and hearing the debate.

Biden is correcting again. That's the bottom line. Biden knows what he's talking about. Ryan is trying to remember facts and turn them into truthiness. It is so obvious.

[T-S]

Ah! One thing I forgot: Martha said "social security is going broke..." First of all, that's not true. Everybody's bank account goes broke if they don't make a deposit. I hate that "broke" language. They are several good fixes. She should know that.

And so Ryan goes on and on about how much social security helped him. That's why he wants to save it - by limiting it for everyone else. If people didn't hear his selfishness in that exchange, they never will. I wish my payment into social security had never given him his college education and his mother her second job. Anybody including Hal that missed the extreme miserliness of that answer will never really objectively analyze anything. That's Ayn Rand's influence on Ryan and he should be thrown out of office.

"Hand in the cookie jar" about the money from medicare. That's shameful. That's on its face an absolute lie. Martha is quizzing Ryan again on his SS math. So much truthiness. And Hal, you fell for every word of it.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

i doubt ill find more than a "few" who will agree with me here among the extreme rabid libbers, but this blog and this city is irrelevant to national politics. The nation was not impressed by Joe's antics. Everyone knows who the adult in the room was. They're now saying Joe's nutty performance is unprecedented.

[T-S]

I don't really care how many people fall for Ryan's truthiness. The fact that it is "truthiness" and not factual just makes you all that much more foolish. I can't change fools. I just wish you weren't taking our country down with you.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

a grimfaced , "arms akimbo" "greeting" awaits Laughin' Joe from Michelle and Barack upon his return to the White House, especially Michelle. The RNC has just released a new ad featuring Ryan talking about serious topics while Romney smirks, smiles, sneers, snickers horselaughs grimaces and mugs like a hyena. very powerful ad.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

obviouslt Biden not Romney.....

[Hedge Fund Hal]

NBC Poll has it 56/36 Ryan........

[BlackRhino]

but this blog and this city is irrelevant to national politics.
Posted by: Hedge Fund Hal | October 11, 2012 at 09:11 PM

Your wrong Thomas, I’m working on the Ohio angle. I’m originally from Ohio, and I’m working to help the people of Ohio do some work for their future.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

you can spout your "truthiness" crap and other words you guys think are such cute clever putdowns T-S and feel all superior to us "fools", but the fact of the matter is, as apparently even you are now acknowledging("taking our country down with you") Romney has turned this election around dramatically, with Obama's, and now Biden's help.

[sparky]

"They are now saying..."
CNN offered this correction:

SPECIAL NOTE OF CAUTION #2: The sample of debate-watchers in this poll were 31% Democratic and 33% Republican. That indicates that the sample of debate watchers is about eight points more Republican than an average CNN poll of all Americans, so the respondents were more Republican than the general public."

It's ok..we know how you feel. We felt the same way last week. As someone upthread said " when Romney interrupted and talked like a machine gun, he was being 'strong' and what Biden did was 'rude' and 'unhinged'. The biggest difference is Joe had facts. Romney/Ryan did not.

[sparky]

Here is the whole quote:

"
According to This Poll

A CNN/ORC International post-debate poll shows that 48% of likely voters think Paul Ryan won the vice-presidential debate, while 44% think Joe Biden won.

SPECIAL NOTE OF CAUTION #1: This poll does not and cannot reflect the views of all Americans. It only represents the views of people who watched the debate. SPECIAL NOTE OF CAUTION #2: The sample of debate-watchers in this poll were 31% Democratic and 33% Republican. That indicates that the sample of debate watchers is about eight points more Republican than an average CNN poll of all Americans, so the respondents were more Republican than the general public.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

ok i guess we can scrap CNN'S poll showing Ryan with a modest win, and surely your libber NBC poll will put me in my place with a big Biden - uh...ohhh......NBC 56/36 Ryan?.......oh ...ok... allrighty then.......

[Chucks]

Just finished watching the McKenna/inslee debate. It was much better than the Paul Ryan/Homer Simpson debate.
The biggest thing that I picked tonight is that I am going to get a job as a used car salesman in Seattle. I'll bet that I could make a crap load of money. Many of you will buy any line of crap. You buy Homer's slick presentation as factual.

[Bernard Goldberg]

So your wife is making you get a j, a ja. a job?

[Chucks]

Bwahahahahhahahahahahahaha.
The guy that lives accross the street from me just took his Obama/Biden yard sign, broke it and threw it in the trash!!!
Now that is hope you can believe in.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

Biden said tonight that they never knew about the cables and secure communications from Stevens in Benghazi asking , no begging for more security. If this can be proven as a lie , looks like Lughin' Joe really stepped in it once again for Boss Obama. Except this time its not a joke- it's dead serous.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

chucks- a scene repeated in yards across the nation tonight and tomorrow morning as the man of the house leaves for work. Men are supposed to behave like men, debate or no debate, not like chimpanzees or hyenas. Wait for the SNL lampoon of the debate this weekend. it will ne Biden's Gerald Ford moment in 1976, the one that Ford reached with SNL and Chevy Chase's impressions of him and just could never recover from . Romney was no comparison . He was aggressive, but alaways polite, civil and respectful....even Chris Mathews said he was civil and respectful to Obama in the debate, he was really impressed by that.

[KS blathers]

Biden is a better debater than Obama, but less presidential.

That’s because Ryan lied so much.
Biden busted the neocon crazy train.
Posted by: Finis Hominis | October 11, 2012 at 08:09 PM

What specifically do you think he lied about ?
Settle down - take a valium. Biden could not explain what was malarkey because he is demagoging - he is full of dog squeeze with passion.

I'll tell you what Biden lied about. 1) Iran has a casing for a nuclear weapon - Ryan should have challenged him there. 2) He lied about Obamacare saving money, just to name a few. 3) Not raising taxes on the middle class as Ryan pointed out 12 new taxes from Obamacare will. He looked like a goombah the rest of the time.

[Chucks]

"When a wise person debates with a fool, the fool rages and laughs, and there is no peace and quiet".
-Prverbs 29:9

[Hedge Fund Hal]

2008 veep debate was Biden versus Palin , in other words- fool versus fool. That's why we haven't really been able to clearly see this guy exposed for the last four years. Until tonight. Hannity said he was actually frightened by Biden's erratic behavior. I was disturbed a bit myself, in between my loud horselaughing at him. People really can't see this guy as the President, in an emergency, after tonight, if they ever could before.

[Observer]

On this one I'll agree with Hal. I 'suspect' that the Administration WAS aware of the appeal for help from our military, why wouldn't they know? With technology allowing direct viewing of the take-out of OBL, you mean our communications aren't up to it?? I just loved how Biden threw the intelligence community under the bus, then tried to assure us that intelligence was 'so good' on Iran. Chucks got it right too, seriously 'would YOU buy a used car from Biden'. Not in this life time. Was Biden better than his boss in debating skills, yes but comparing to Pres Obama's latest outing in this regard is not really fair. Our President should be allowed to use a telepromter.
Still on the fence, but 'leaning' right.

[nameless]

quoting the bible, name calling and rewriting history. this is how right wing sore losers respond.

[KS blathers]

Is that all you have ? You project the leftwing mindset well, nameless - Obama lost the 1st debate so he accused Romney of lieing, but that coming from a known liar did not pass the smell test.

Joe "Krusty the Klown" Biden behaved like a buffoon and laughed about security matters, but that's all he had. Too bad, because he showed passion, but he also lied about Libya and about not taxing the middle class. Only low information voters would have believed that.

[Hedge Fund Hal]

Obama's got to be cussing out Hillary for turning down the offer, reported by several sources, to give her the 2012 veep spot on the ticket, that was allegedly made to her last summer, before the convention. Numbers are in- no bump for Obama from Krusty the Klown's performance last night. Only the most rabid partisans are defending Joe's obnoxious behavior

[T-S]

A calm and informed Biden confronted a nervous, stiff lying Ryan who resorted to platitudes.

We all saw it. And the only one on this blog that cares about cars during a vice-presidential debate is also our biggest proven hypocrite.

[T-S]

Straight from Bloomberg: They say they have six independent studies -- six! -- that "have confirmed the soundness of the Governor’s tax plan," and so I should stop whining...

The Romney campaign sent over a list of the studies... four of them are blog posts or op-eds. I'm not hating -- I blog for a living -- but I don't generally describe my posts as "studies."

...None of the analyses do what Romney's campaign says: show that his tax plan is sound.

...The Tax Policy Center paper that sparked this discussion found that Romney's plan couldn't work because his tax rate cuts would provide $86 billion more in tax relief to people making over $200,000 than Romney could recoup by eliminating tax expenditures for that group. That means his plan is necessarily a tax cut for the rich, so if Romney keeps his promise not to grow the deficit, he'll have to raise taxes on the middle class.

Various analyses have adjusted TPC's assumptions in an effort to bring down that $86 billion deficit. But getting from $86 billion down to $0 is not enough to make Romney's proposal work. For Romney's math to add up, he actually needs a substantial surplus of a high-income base broadening above the cost of his high-income rate cuts.

The lies just keep coming. And fools keep believing them.

[KS blathers]

The choice is clear. T-S identifies with low information voters.

[T-S]

That doesn't even make sense. What choice? I post an analysis of a lie your side keeps saying and I'm low information? At least try to sound intelligent.