LARadio.com loves them some TBTL...

Too Beautiful to Live is kicking podcasting ass, and Don Barrett of the influential LA radio site, LARadio.com gets it. Read his insightful and slobbering story about localite Luke Burbank and his little show.

Luke admitted that his KIRO show wasn’t very good at getting ratings. “Talk radio tends to attract an older listener and PPM just wreaked havoc on KIRO as it has on talk stations all over the country, and so when they said they weren’t renewing, I understood. “Gentleman, I can’t believe you let this go on for as long as you did,” I told my bosses. “We named the show ‘Too Beautiful to Live’ meaning this thing was probably too weird for this world on commercial radio. I thought we were going to get fired after a month or two. The fact that the show went on for almost two years is a testament to how early the Mormons go to bed. I don’t just think they weren’t listening. I literally think they had a Tab or a de-caf coffee and went to bed because the show was completely bizarre.

Luke had high praise for the Bonneville corporation. “When I left it was a lot like my divorce that I had with my first wife. It was very amicable. I really do like the people at KIRO. I have a great deal of respect for them. They were real straight shooters with me but I was always amazed that they never saw the value of this thing we were developing with podcasting. I’m surprised nobody said anything while I was trademarking this. I don’t think traditional radio broadcasters have seen any value in this. While this was coming together there wasn’t anyone who was realizing I was creating, developing and owning this thing that would be pretty valuable to me at some point.”

Comments

[Hour No. Two]

Podcasting! hahahaha!

I guess its the 'ones' now, a big let down after the 'tens'.

[Mac Riekling]

> LARadio.com

Who?

> Luke Burbank

At the risk of being repetitive, who?

[ISMOB]

the last guy who walked through KIRO's swing shift revolving door; he now has a taxpayer-funded podcast (since Congress OK'ed the unemployment extension, anyway)

[Andrew]

That's a lot of fluff. I like LB and I listen to his show almost every day, but let's get real, his podcast numbers are padded with listeners in other cities and states, and he can't woo local sponsors if he has a largely national listenership.

So that leaves national sponsors. I don't know if many of you have XM Radio, but it has ads, and they're mostly obnoxious ads for beauty product and body-part enlargement scams and Rosie O'Donnell talking about how fat she is. It's weird. Don't ask. It's not a good time for satelite radio.

It's been proven time and time again that you can't count on young people to turn out. Ask a politician. Ask Conan O'Brien. I think LB will have more success as he goes, as his listeners become older, more reliable people.

[Tommy008]

if you'er show needs retoooling, you're schtick needs some help, just admit it, maybe do some podcasts for a while, change s ome things around that were putting people off , liek the whole "teen talk" style thing, and then try to get a real job, on the air, again. Stop with he Emperor's New Clothes thing and all the rationalizations. Stop with the , "we're so cool, we're above and beyomd lameass old radio and their old fart listeners"...... what is it about Luke Burbank that is so incredibly annoying?.. i think i just touched on aome of it.... the successful people in the entertainment business learn and grow from their critics and mistakes and prosper... Burbank is doing the opposite... I see a paper hat waiting for him, with his name on it, at Dick's order wndow on Broadway again....

[Tommy008]

hey Burbank - did it ever occur to you that something "the Moromns" and most people over 17 don't really care for could just be a lousy, crappy radio show, not something so cool it's just over their lame heads? of course not.

[Duffman]

This, from someone who predicted that Suits wouldn't last 6-mos at KFI (Los Angeles), and that Shires wouldn't be back on the air.
Yep, we can really take this to the bank...better follow this expert advice Luke.

[Tommy008]

---------Burbank is a one-trick pony, incapable of growing beyond the silly,adolescent show he's been doing for 3 years, even as he nears forty.. Silly works when you're d a kid.... not afterwards...Although he never had near the original success, Burbank reminds me of pathetic loser Gene Simmons, still putting on that gimmicky Kubuki makeup and costume on his sagging face, and chubby, portly body as he moves toward sixty years on....

[Duffman]

Pathetic...simply pathetic!

[Andrew]

Burbank has said the mean people on these blogs are just sad they don't have their own radio show. I don't know about that, but I sense that a lot of older people here are bitter that they're no longer a part of the "target demographic", no longer at the center of attention, no longer desired as listeners. Criticizing Burbank isn't going to bring back your youthful good looks. Sorry :(

[Duffman]

Again I find myself in agreement with Andrew...this is getting scary. [smile]

[TomF]

I liked TBTL (and at 49 I am way outside the target demo) and I was sorry it got cancelled, forcing me over to the BBC World News at 700pm. But the point made earlier about the unreliability of the under-30 demo is spot on. Not only are their media consumption patterns totally different (as Conan found out) but they have been raised to believe all information is free... so they instinctively rebel against any subscription or ad-support model. Pretty hard to put groceries in your fridge catering to a fickle, cynical, parsimonious audience like that. How many "listeners" would Luke still have if TBTL downloads were offered at a half-buck a shot?

[Tommy008]

Demographics...what a crock of nonsense.... the type of radio sho w i like isn't much different than the average25- 35 year old who acts his or her age..how's that younger demo thing working, Luke...worked real well on TBTL...Burbank thought that everyone under 35 was just as immature and silly as he was... it's sad that someone who thinks so highly of himself and obviously thinks he should be doing Jimmy Kimmel's show not Jimmy, is such a failure.... "look mommy! everyone's out of step in the parade but me! those pathetic lamers!" Luke will take my order at Dick's on Broadway nezt summer.. and he'll have a smile on his face or his manager will hear about it.......

[Tommy008]

the silent majority out there are pounding their monitors in agreement....

[Tarses]

"Burbank reminds me of pathetic loser Gene Simmons, still putting on that gimmicky Kubuki makeup and costume on his sagging face, and chubby, portly body as he moves toward sixty years on.... "

Really? Gene Simmons is a loser? Based on what criteria? His millions of dollars generated from multiple business ventures? Raising successful and grounded children? His long-term relationship with his beautiful girlfriend? His mansion in Beverly Hills? His ability to pull himself up by his bootstraps and make something of his life despite all odds? Selling 80 million+ albums? Sold out arean tours around the world for the last 35 years? Yeah, he sounds like a real loser. But go ahead, keep talking. I'm sure the more you talk and the LOUDER you talk, you might find someone to buy into your b.s.

Yeah, there's a loser in this conversation but it's not Gene Simmons. I guess there's a reason you're eating at Dick's Drive In...

[Duffman]

'Affirmation without discipline is the beginning of delusion.'
-Jim Rohn

[Duffman]

Excellently put, Tarses. :)

[Andrew]

I think people will get over the "information should be free" idea in due time. It's just backlash from the media companies overpricing content, puting restrictive licenses on their content and being generally abusive to customers.

If media companies had offered the music for 50 cents a track without DRM from the beginning then they could have take a high road, but instead they chose a business strategy that made Napster look like a really really good deal, and the young people just modified their personal philosophies to permit that form of thievery.

[Tommy008]

Simmons is the kind of giu who started out in his late teens with a dream to make tremendous money, not tremendous music....there's a differewnce...yeah Simmons is a loser now, you bet. yeah he had a successful gimmmick-driven band in the 70.s and 80,s that still will never get into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame because it's mediocrity doeasn't warrant it. They should have disbanded 25 years ago and gone on to do new things. At least Simmons should of, with the ego on him.... The Beatles all went on to do their own thing...yes he does look ridiculous with his platform boots on ,prancing on with the old gimmick costume and makeup he wore in his twenties... his music isn't strong enough to stand alone stripped of the Kabuki gimmick . big fat egotistical clown.....did you see on TMZ where two people, a man and a woman in LA accused him of CHOKING THEM, and threatening to "end them" recently.....he's a scumbag... and a loser..

[Tommy008]

on that A and E waste of a show of his, he looks like its still "ALL ABOUT GENE" even when he's around his kids. He comes off like he couldn't care less about his kids..... if his kids are indeed well-grounded ( you certainly don't know that) it's not because of him, it's because of their mother and other relatives...

[Tommy008]

Paul McCartney and Ringo Starr aren't appearing at the White River Amphitheatre this weekend, in front of a backup band, wearing their moptop haircuts and lapel-less jackets from 1964, doing reprises of Love Me Do and She Loves You...... Simmons has the ego you would expect on someone of the stature of the Beatles...his ego is unjustified....

[Duffman]

Paul and Ringo could not do 'the Beatles' as well as 'RAIN'. They (RAIN) are coming to town this summer; if you like the Beatles, by all means SEE THIS GROUP...they even do songs on stage that the Beatles could only do in the recording studio. They're AWESOME! [Coming to the Paramount]

[Andrew]

Good points T008, and your observation about Burbank dismissing all criticism as invalid is proving true.

Burbank does read these threads, he's made reference to specific comments several times and says "we wish we had radio shows", and he mentioned that commentors say that his show has devolved into him and his girlfriend bantering for an hour - and he admits that it has, but insists it's interesting - sort of like Seinfeld. No shit.

But it is boring. It's unbroken, stream of consciousness with no particular topic, it just drifts from one thought to the next with little or no direction. And he's so into it that he'll go up to 45 minutes without remembering to pause for a break. Recently a show ran until 2pm because he got so caught up in his own thoughts, and when he realized it he said it was like a bonus for listeners to get all that extra TBTL.

I hate to say this, but it's obvious that this guy really likes the smell of his own farts. He is absolutely confident that beautiful poetry just spews from his open mouth. He doesn't honestly self-criticize. He's not truly aware of his own shortcomings.

The most glaring problem with his show at the moment (of course there is no problem with his show) is that it has no structure. He just plays an attention whore to a microphone for an hour everyday. I need to know that I can tune in and it won't just be all about him. Provide some relevant commentary. Catch us up on the gossip and the odd happenings of the day. Devote discrete blocks of time to features. Keep the me me me stuff down to a few minutes or less.

He criticizes others saying "they wish they had radio shows"... well we have every right to criticize him for sucking at the one he has. As long as he's at the helm of a fledgling podcast I think his best bet is to 1) shut up and 2) act on the assumption that he's doing something wrong, not right.

[Andrew]

Rain is awesome. KBSG hosted them a few years ago, the band stepped off a Concord at the museum of flight an re-enacted the Beatles coming to America. I'm not sure if Frank Shiers was there because I didn't know of him at the time.

[Duffman]

RAIN is coming to SEATTLE! [But you won't get 'soaked' on this]

Seattle, WA
Friday, 7 May 2010, 8:00pm
Saturday, 8 May 2010, 2:00 & 8:00pm
Sunday, 9 May 2010, 1:00pm
ON SALE NOW

Paramount Theatre

[AprilMayJune]

The last thing I want is my own radio show. There is no logic in him saying that about his critics. By the same reasoning, if I criticize the POTUS, does that mean I want to be POTUS? Makes no sense.

[Tommy008]

i'm listening to TBTL podcast from tonight--- first time listening to the show in 6 months- still doing the weighing himself thing...... the little red wagon clip...now he's talking about getting his cat to urinate in the box....

[Andrew]

I get the sense that Luke Burbank thinks "I've got XXX thousand podcast downloads so I must be doing something right", but that's not necessarily the case.

His show wasn't built from the ground up, it was catapulted into orbit with heavy promotion from KIRO during 2008 and 2009, a level of promotion it couldn't afford or justify in it's present form.

His KIRO show was cancelled because he "narrowcasted" so to speak, to younger hipster types, and all but insulted older listeners. Now he's narrowcasting even more with the podcast. In order to listen you have to 1) be a young hipster and 2) enjoy hearing coffee shop banter between a guy and his girlfriend for an hour and a half. How much more selective can his podcast become before his listener base shrinks to one person?

I think it's awesome that he keeps plugging away at it because he could improve and make a comeback, but he doesn't seem willing to admit any kind of fault.

[Tommy008]

Strangely, during the first 5 minutes of the litter box story (i bailed after 5 minutes of litter box talk , so he could have gone on for an hour, and probably did) Burbank kept repeating the name of his cat, Pagoda. A normal person would say the name of the cat at the top of the story, as he did, but then tell the story for a while before saying the name again. Almost every single time the cat came up in the story, he said-"my cat, Pagoda". Did you know that Luke's cat is named Pagoda? Isn't that cool. He doesn't have a cat named Socks or Jinx, like some lameass old fart would name his cat. Luke's cat is named Pagoda. Yeah, it's Pagoda like in eastern, eastern religion, etc. yEAH, Luke's cat has a really awesome. cool hipster's name. He calls is Pagoda? How cool is that? Pagoda. That's his cat's name. Cool. Pagoda.

[Tommy008]

his cat, Pagoda.

[whatwouldtseliotdo?]

Tommy008: what compels you to make multiple comments disparaging TBTL? isn't one enough? there are 10 comments on here from you. You are way too obsessed with something that doesn't have anything to do with you.

[Tommy008]

hahaa hey if you don't like it you know what you can do about it Whatwould.....YOU'VE GOT TO BE A TBTL fan,......i break my commentary up into small posts...so really it's just a several hundred word little article about him when you add up the words... hardly obsession territory......anyway, really none of your business ...insted of criticizing me over nothing why don't you tell us why you like Luke so much...

[Duffman]

Now, now...no need getting so excited over a little pussy....er, er Pagoda, that is.

[Tommy008]

bwahaahahahaahaha.... good one, Duffman!!

[Andrew]

I criticize TBTL because I want a decent radio show to listen to. I complain because I care.

[Tommy008]

i've also admitted, like Andrew that i would take a restructured, more disciplined and more fast-paced version of TBTL over Frank Shiers, who is intolerable..... Luke had a chance to maybe do a Bryan Suits, become rehired at KIRO OR SOME OTHER STATION, IF HE PROVED WITH HIS PODCASTS THAT HE HAD CHANGED THE SHOW FOR THE BETTER....after listening last night to the litter box talk at the opening of his show , i am convinced that he is blowing any chance at a comeback... the show is slower, sillier and more self-indulgent than ever....

[whatwouldtseliotdo?]

@Tommy008:

You are probably right. He may be blowing his chance at a radio comeback, but I don't care about that. TBTL isn't a radio show. It is very slow paced and heavily reliant on inside jokes (and admittedly a degree of voyeurism on the listener's part) - it is essentially just eavesdropping on a group of friends rambling about the minutiae that make their lives work. For me, that is super interesting, but I am definitely in a minority when compared to the listenership of almost ALL other radio programs. Yet before you begin criticizing my taste, consider this: I worked full time throughout my college career. I volunteer at local non-profits. I am not just some 20 year old idiot who feels he is entitled to everything. The reason listening to Luke talk about his cat is interesting to me is the same reason listening to my grandfather talk about his trip to the protologist is interesting: I like the guy. I just like Luke, Jenn, and Sean. They seem like very caring, kind-hearted people who are trying to figure out how to live in the 21st century. Are they perfect? No, of course not. I'm sure they can all be a-holes, I just don't see them that way permanently. So if you hate TBTL, go right ahead. I hate eggs and never feel bad about it. But I just don't see WHY TBTL offends anyone. It's not even on the radio anymore. There is NO WAY TBTL will ever accidentally come on in your car or your home.

[Andrew]

Luke has a talent for seeming like a good friend, and I think it affords him an ability to be neglectful of listeners and come away unscathed. Just yesterday a listeners asked where his TBTL shirt was as the pledge drive was ~ 4 weeks ago and Luke said, to paraphrase, "fuck you."

Obviously Luke has some listeners. The question is can he get enough to of them to be profitable. I don't know about his financials but it's looking like the answer is no, not at this rate.

I usually listen up until the point he starts trailing off into tedium with his girlfriend, which tends to be about 15-30 mins in. On the rare day it's solid all the way through. I want his show to be improve and succeed. His success directly correlates with my listening enjoyment.

[whatwouldtseliotdo?]

I can respect that healthy critique Andrew, well played.

[Tommy008]

ok fair enough Whatwould. You're basically saying Burbank is podcasting to a clique of people, the "posse of admirers" i referred to in the past....you're validating Andrew's claim that he's narrowcasting down to a very small pool. This pool of people almost necessarily has to like him and his cohorts, like them enough to want to be personal friends with them if they had the chance, in order for them to put up with the new "intimate", slow format. There are very few radio hosts I feel that way about. I cetainly don't feel that way about Luke and company, althought they'er not bad or evi lpeople, I'm sure. That has never kept me from listening to a particular radio host, if he or she had the chops, the skills to keep me interested for an hour or more. If the host has those things I will listen to them at least for an hour even when I dislike them personally. Burbank's whole thing is that he thinks he can monetize this podcast thing and bypass the old "gatekeepers" in traditional radio. I say it will be impossible to monetize a show that has devolved into a format that makes such high demands from it's listeners....

[Duffman]

The thing I wonder about is WHAT connection KIRO-FM still has with Luke? The fact that KIRO-FM 'My Northwest' site still advertises his podcast makes me think there is still some contractual relationship that they are honoring? Curious?

[Tommy008]

ohhh, are you saying KIRO is basically doing the old Jim Morra deal with Burbank? how else could he be keeping up with his mortgage payments on that house in Mount Baker? That neighborhood is fairly pricey.

[Andrew]

KIRO and TBTL benefit from the cross-promotion. People find one and take notice of the other, and I think the wigs at KIRO still have some crazy idea that young listeners are the future. If I were a PD I'd be hitting up retirement homes and showing them how to operate the radio dial. They might not be a great demo but at least they will listen eight hours a day.

I can't imagine KIRO pays Burbank because it doesn't appear that he contributes to ad revenue at all. They might give him an operating allowance or something. How he pays the bills is a mystery to me.

[whatwouldtseliotdo?]

You've got it right Andrew, KIRO thinks they are benefitting from the traffic TBTL's website gets. However, they are not paying Luke at all other than allowing him to use some of their equipment and are hosting the site for him.

Also, good point on their ads not benefitting from being on TBTL's site. It's usually an ad for Fox News or Some Seattle based construction company... Most 10s are neither Fox News fans or even necessarily in the Seattle area.

And Tommy008, also good point. I must say I expected this to turn into some god-damn flamewar and am happy everyone has been very gracious in their comments.

[Tommy008]

Apparently TBTL is supporting itself through pledge drive money and other random donations. This is more the KRABfm model rather than the NPR modle because NPR has government relationships that the totally private endeavor TBTL does not have. KRAB was a little station in Seattle whose heyday was the late 1960's that supported itself almost entirely on listener donations, and had frequent pledge drives. Unless some bigtime advertising starts kicking in, and this is the funding model they will rely on Burbank better prepare himself for a lot of Top Ramen and perhaps downsizing back to a sleazy apartment..

[Tommy008]

I remember Mike Webb's live webcast/podcast show was puttering away with basically one sponsor that i recall, Korum Ford, although there might have been one or teo more.......i loved the time that Webb played clips of Monson's show on his webcast and called Dori an "idiot"

[Tommy008]

from the "damning with faint praise" department- Itunes describes the TBTL podcast as "an often tedious but occaisionally thrilling journey into the mind of host Luke Burbank"

[Patrick M Fisher]

I'm 46 and I listen to TBTL. It's a great show. Luke and his team get better and better. It's like hanging out with friends and it's a great way to spend an hour each day. I'm sorry some people don't get it.

And I don't think he speaks to a certain demographic.