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I know that not all cons think of things as simplistically as you: if what you said was true, if I am in a serious accident or have a heart attack, and my treatment costs run into tens of thousands of dollars, by your logic (using the word very loosely), I can just say that I would like you to pay for it. You're suggesting that people have choices with their health care, and in this country, if you fall into a specific economic groups, you have no choices. You know this, but your party, and their network, does not allow you to admit it. Of course, most hospitals will not let you die. But they will bill you for charges that are bankrupting millions of hard-working people, and your party has the audacity to label them as "too lazy to afford care". You even use this shallow cons tactic of condescension: "the problem isn't out-of-control capitalism. It's just lazy people", when you speak of "responsible members of our society". This all really boils down to some Americans are willing to let others die, and still others go into irreversible debt. There are no charities that are stepping up to take this problem over, partly because the un-regulated industries you strive to protect not only priced consumers out of the market, but the charities had no hope of ever keeping up with those costs either.
Posted by: Drew | October 08, 2009 at 11:46 PM
Should we collectively take care of one another as you suggest the slope quickly gets slippery.
Where does it stop? After health care then I suppose we move to providing food for all...then housing...then transportation...then college education...then retirement pensions...oops suddenly we're Cuba!
Posted by: Radio is Dead | October 08, 2009 at 11:54 PM
"pre-existing" in the sick care industry of America means "no one has caught it before, but that doesn't mean we're gonna pay for it." It's another excuse for the insurance companies to save money by watching you die.
What is it with these cons and their insistence that the people they don't particularly like should die? It's a "principle" they seem to want to apply, dare I say it, liberally.
Posted by: Drew | October 08, 2009 at 11:55 PM
"Where does it stop? After health care then I suppose we move to providing food for all...then housing...then transportation...then college education"
fantastic!
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | October 09, 2009 at 12:45 AM
I said earlier that conservatives rationalize, the "personal responsibility" spiel is as much.
We all highly value school teachers; they have a gift for explaining complicated ideas to young minds, and it's work frankly most of us would hate to do, and yet they don't get payed particularily well. Does that mean it's irresponsible to be a school teacher?
What if I need a $50,000 heart surgery but I can't afford it because I gave $20,000 to charity over the past decade? Was I irresponsible for giving to charity?
An orphaned child with downs syndrome can't really get gainful employment. Is he or she irresponsible for having been born with down's syndrome?
This is too much. I can't believe grown adults actualy believe this bullshit.
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | October 09, 2009 at 12:54 AM
All full-time school teachers I know have health insurance...done.
If you have health insurance why would you pay 50K for heart surgery? You can get a cheap high deductible (5K) plan for 200 bucks a month....done.
The orphaned special needs child will be supported by a loving family or church. Done.
As I said earlier you can always find a tragedy somewhere. Our system is far from perfect but it still remains the best. Why does everyone continue to want to move here?
Posted by: Radio is Dead | October 09, 2009 at 01:10 AM
C'mon AA; of course they don't believe it. To even try and rationalize something that implausible is either being totally disingenuous on their part, or it's the sign of some serious sociopath defect. And if that's the case, it's reached serious epidemic proportions.
Posted by: Drew | October 09, 2009 at 01:15 AM
Canadians are not moving here for health care. Brits are not moving here either. By everyone, do you mean Guam? The Japanese are staying put. So are the French. But the reverse is true for the above mentioned countries. Must be they're trying to get away from those meddling christian charities...
Posted by: Drew | October 09, 2009 at 01:20 AM
We know that RayDeeOhOh is not so thick as to believe that your average health insurance policy covers 100% of the freight for heart surgery of any kind.
Posted by: Drew | October 09, 2009 at 01:29 AM
Oh really...here's a very simple question. (It's amazing how all the Blammers avoid answering the easy ones)
If you were on your deathbed with a bizarre life threatening disease where would you prefer to be treated...France? Canada? Sweden? I doubt that.
A little unknown secret is that hospitals make enormous profits from wealthy foreign patients looking for expert care.
Furthermore...did you notice all the Nobel Prize winners in Medicine were once again Americans...in fact Americans have once again swept all categories except for Literture...well I guess you can read a good book at that Slovakian hospital.
Posted by: Radio is Dead | October 09, 2009 at 01:38 AM
Ray Taliefaro is talking about the god damn moon...must be a slow news night.
Posted by: Radio is Dead | October 09, 2009 at 01:40 AM
Radio, you're rationilizing again. If a teacher has a pre-existing condition they won't be covered. As Drew pointed out many insurers don't cover the entire tab. Who's to say there will always be a loving family for every handicapped orphan? There's no guarantee, no security. Canadians have security. Are you going to let the Canadians show you up?
And on top of that you're missing the point. If a person gives $20k to charity and later on can't afford medical bills, then you will say they were foolish to have given that money to charity. So how much money should I retain for personal emergencies? How about two million? Suppose I need a torso transplant, it might cost two million dollars. I won't give to charity until I have accumulated two million dollars, because to give any sooner would be irresponsible.
Yes, I think I'm getting this rationilizing thing down. I'll be a greedy Republican before this night is through.
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | October 09, 2009 at 02:40 AM
The pre-existing condition never comes into play as long as you've maintained your coverage.
Maybe you folks just don't understand that.
There's no excuse for allowing your insurance to lapse.
Personal responsibility! If you go without insurance you're playing Russian roulette.
Posted by: Radio is Dead | October 09, 2009 at 03:16 AM
They don't have to maintain coverage in Canada. Why can't our system be as reliable as Canada?
And dare I say there might be perfectly legitmate reasons why a responsible person's insurance would lapse. Suppose you live in Ohio and you factory just shut down and now the local unemployment rate is 50%, you're unemployed for 18 months and you can no longer afford or even acquire COBRA. Are hard working Americans irresponsible for simply being hard working Americans?
You have nothing but hair brained quick fixes. Your a sharpshooter with a shotgun.
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | October 09, 2009 at 03:28 AM
Your wrong because the law states that COBRA be made available to you.
As my personal friend Dori Monson says...what stops you from putting away a few bucks every month for that proverbial "rainy day".
What part of the term "personal responsibility" do you not understand?
Posted by: Radio is Dead | October 09, 2009 at 03:36 AM
COBRA might be available but it's not cheap, not everyone can afford it.
Economic conditions in some parts of the country preclude saving much money, certainly not enough to cover any medical emergency that might occurr.
The "personal responsibility" ideal is a thought experiment that doesn't work in reality. Human beings aren't uniformly repsonsible to such a degree that a nation can be operate within that ideal. There is too much random variation and irresponsibilty among people for it to work as one would hope. In reality the irresponsible will always be a burden on the responsible, the question is how you choose to handle it. Do you work with them or do you hold them off with guns and barbed wire?
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | October 09, 2009 at 03:47 AM
RayDeeUhOh would not survive with this mantra as a motivational speaker in Akron, or Lansing, or Gary. In fact, he wouldn't survive the beating he'd get. Maybe Dori can give him some emotional support.
But we see that RayDeeOh came back today, to the blog he loves to hate. He should at least send Hood a thank you card for letting him steal another free ride on the Blatherwatch Bus, when others are paying his fare again.
Posted by: Drew | October 09, 2009 at 09:36 AM
I donated half my foodstamps to Bla'M. I'll divide the remaining half between &rew and RID to show my appreciation for the enlightening debate, and &rew gets the most for being right. I hope you know how to use foodstamps (EBT), RID...you have to have a PIN.
Posted by: Fremont | October 09, 2009 at 10:43 AM