The PPM ratings, now the way of the world, were brutal to the established order in Seattle radio.
While we sit re-baiting our breaths waiting to hear if KVI and Fisher Radio have snatched Rush Limbaugh from Bonneville's KTTH, we ask the question: Will Bonneville significantly change the line-up in KIROFM to make it work in Seattle?
(photo: Dori Monson- "will dance for ratings")
(Fisher and Bonneville already know whether KTTH will hang onto Big Pants; but they're not saying... yet. Fisher's decision whether to re-invest in KVI is said to be hanging in the balance. Radio has long sucked back row in a company long ago glamoured by teevee. The soulless riff-raff in the upper echelons are said to be re-enthused since the new ratings have put KOMO in the top 10, but are also said to be openly pessimistic about a future for KVI if they don't get Rush back. Does that mean sale of the heritage talker or turning it into oldies? We'll see).
KTTH is at # 13 now (down from the Old World ranking of #4). All due respect to Dave Boze (m-f, 3-6p) but where the hell would be KTTH be without Limbaugh, who's knocking down the biggest numbers of his long career?
Meanwhile, KIROAM, a longtime market leader is now bogged down in a narrow-cast sports audience (at 17th in the market) and the expensive talk-help at KIROFM, Dave Ross, Dori Monson, Ron & Don and Luke Burbank are speaking to sitting room only audiences down at 18th in the terrestrial market.
Retired radio veteran Bill Wippel writes:
It's amazing that KIRO's owners shifted the AM programming to FM. It may have worked in DC, where there are few hills and mountain ranges. But not in this area. Imagine a blow-torch like KIRO-AM at 50,000 watts, which covers half the state, shrinking to a signal that barely gets out of King County! It must be a miserable time for the Eastlake Crusaders of Common Sense.
Will Bonneville, who's always been flexible and one of the few national media corporations with capital, make programming changes to get back on top? Radioland is finding that big media isn't willing to re-invest in what many consider the dinosaur technology that is radio.
Could some of these sacred KIRO dayparts be endangered? We can't imagine how that would work, but maybe Dave & Dori aren't so sacred in the Salt Lake City caverns of the LDS Church who directly own the company.
Dori is learning to dance, looking into Mormonism, and going to space (or did he already go?). There are more giveaways and contests and the classic AM dial flim-flam to get more listeners.
But stunts, and promos are Old World bandaids-when push comes to shove: it's the programming, stupid.
Dave Ross has established himself as a man of the community. A moderate liberal in a moderate liberal region. He's like us but measured and well spoken. He could have another go at an elected office. He's a shoo in for city council.
Ron and Don's act is generic enough to pick up and carry to another market. They could get steady work hosting private events.
Dori Monson on the other hand doesn't appear to have any substantial talents outside of soapboxing, few merits outside of local media, no credibility as a community builder and little or no good will with elected officials. I doubt even local Republicans would want their brand associated with his ego - all the while producing fewer Google result hits than Tim Eyman. He claims he attempted to operate a book store and failed. BUT he has the world all figured out. I look forward to seeing what he does next. Maybe he will become channel 7's Ken Shram(?) and complain about stuff while sipping on a latte.
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | July 21, 2009 at 02:07 AM
are it the programming?? I don't know...are it???
well I can tell you probably had a past job as a PI reporter....and hopefully someone will see this post before you delete it... ha ha
Posted by: yourpal | July 21, 2009 at 03:11 AM
Major changes are coming to talk radio. But then I already brought that up in a prrevious post. So here are some random thoughts and speculations.
1...Dori Monson is a terrific entertainer. He knows how to have fun with his program. However he takes many of his issues far to seriously. His confrontation with Mayor Nickels, when he challenged the mayor to showw he he promoted new freedoms, was insulting. If I were the mayor I would have unloaded on him. It is no wonder many local leaders ignore him when they find their personal integrity insulted.
2...TBTL is perfect for it's time slot. It has a cult followimg. Many of you hate it because you would rather have it's three hours filled with someone promoting your causes. Sorry folks but we can't be serious all of the time.
3...Does anyone really enjoy R & D? It seems to me that way too much of their show sounds like two homeless guys standing around begging for handouts. I cannot grasp how KIRO lets them get away with blowing their own trumpet over all the charitable causes they endorse.
4...I would like to have at least an hour or two of drive time news in the afternoon.
5...And what is the deal with top of the hour news in the morning concentrating on traffic reports and local if it bleeds it leads stories! When my radio cranks on at 6 AM I want to hear the top national/world news, not some story about how some clown is broke down on I-90.
6...If KIRO is going to broadcast on FM then at least do it in stereo.
7...KTTH should just go away. Send the group over to KVI. KIRO could use the signal to save face after the disaster of dumping AM.
8...Let 2/3rds of area stations just fade away and die. Likely the only reason that doesn't happen is because of being able to be used to funnel money around for tax purposes.
9...Yikes, its late. I gotta run. Any thoughts? Radio is not going to go away. But it is going to adjust. A LOT.
Posted by: ryder | July 21, 2009 at 08:29 AM
Rush isn't moving anywhere. KTTH just re-upped with his syndicator so he stays on 770.
Posted by: Corporate Suit | July 21, 2009 at 08:35 AM
This does not portend good karma for KVI, does it?
Posted by: Duffman | July 21, 2009 at 09:00 AM
It's the programming? Or the signal?
I just returned from Raymond and could not get KIRO FM at all. I can get it sometimes in Whatcom County. I'm able to reliably get KPTK until about 9 pm in Whatcom.
I think Bill said it very well. What's the point of great programming if no one can hear it?
Too many stations, Ryder? Hmm. There are a lot of different tastes out there and I like that there are lesser voices meeting niche and local needs. Not every radio personality requires a six-figure salary.
Sounds like you're working, Ryder. Hope so.
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 09:23 AM
Careful joanie, you & I (specifically mentioned) are apparently being monitored by 'Billy Bob' for frequency of posts. [smile]
Posted by: Duffman | July 21, 2009 at 09:32 AM
Good observation about R&D sounding like homeless beggars. It made sense when they were breaking into the market but they had posted some substantial ratings last year and never took down the "homeless New Orleans refugees" signs.
And now TBTL has hit 100,000 podcast downloads or whatever and they still refer to their "tens of listeners." These are the tactics of NPR, not commercial radio.
Posted by: AuthenticAndrew | July 21, 2009 at 10:31 AM
I saw that Duff. If it weren't, it would be someone else. No one is forcing him to read nor preventing him from posting. Less confident people always need someone to blame.
Ignore it.
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 10:31 AM
Thinking about it . . . I don't completely disagree with him. But I handle it by skimming and then moving on. Do you read every post? Some of the political conversations seem interminable to me. So, we all have our peeves . . . but we handle them like adults. Most of the time. (insert smiley face)
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 10:38 AM
The reason KIRO morning news is all traffic and weather is because they let all their reporting staff go. The idiots gave away their ages-old news franchise to the competitors, KUOW & KOMO. Now they got nothin'. Entercom fucked up the news, and I thought B'ville was saving it. In the long haul they did it worse. Tony Miner who is a real newsman is now the third stooge on the Ron and Don Show. So sad.
Posted by: Mark C. | July 21, 2009 at 11:50 AM
'Tony Miner who is a real newsman is now the third stooge on the Ron and Don Show. So sad.'
You know that's an interesting statement Mark. I don't know Tony but have thought him to sound very professional until I heard him get mixed up with the superflous rhetoric of R&D. They shouldn't let that happen as it diminishes his stature and is (like you say) sad indeed.
Posted by: Duffman | July 21, 2009 at 11:56 AM
I continue to be puzzled why anyone still listens to KIRO. It seems to be a consensus on here that it is no longer a good station...so.....? Turn it to something else!
Posted by: sparky | July 21, 2009 at 12:01 PM
I don't see a consensus here. I've talked about an inability to get the station... I still prefer Dave Ross and listen to him whenever possible. He's not perfect but no one is.
Michael does seem to be blaming the programming though he references Whipple's post about the signal.
BTW, you posted that you coudn't get KIRO very well. So, is it the programming or the signal for you? I know you prefer Thom but I don't understand what you have against KIRO. Ross tackles national issues, state issues and local issues. That's why I like him so much. Check out his show logs at My Northwest. They are very diverse. Unless you podcast, he just can't be heard anymore outside a small circle of friends.
Anybody remember that song?
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 12:21 PM
I still listen to KIRO. They have local hosts who tackle this communities' issues. Except for Kirby Wilbur, KVI (who I regard as a weak talk show host) there aren't many who tackle local issues and politics. I like TBTL (at night) because it's loose and has developed personalities and I think Luke Burbank is a genuine talent with a steel-trap type memory and an amazing ability to recall...and a great vocabulary.
Jen (his producer/assistant) is one heck of an orgaziner and would probably easily be on a national lever (Luke is fortunate to have her). R&D (in my view) is their weakest link and even tho I do listen to them at times, it's one time during a typical week-day that I do search for another.
I DO agree with those herein however who think that KIRO made a huge mistake in switching to FM. At first I thought they might make it work...but alas it ain't happening so it's time for them to recognize their mistake, own up to it and proceed to make a change. I would have to think 'it's in the works' ? Let's hope so.
Posted by: Duffman | July 21, 2009 at 12:25 PM
The talk demographic is 60+. that's why the the PPM ratings are all music, and why nobody gives a shit about this but a few on this blog, and the dwindling staffs on the stations.
Posted by: DT | July 21, 2009 at 12:28 PM
Look outside your winndow
there's a woman being grabbed
they've dragged to the bushes
and now she's bein' stabbed
Joanie, you just gave away your age group.
I am so sorry.
No, I am not yet working.
Posted by: ryder | July 21, 2009 at 12:31 PM
Everybody claims Limbaugh is a repulsive douchebag but he annihilates the competition in the ratings. Bill O'Reilly is the consensus pick as the biggest jerk in cable news talk but he consistently obliterates Keith Olbermann in the ratings. Who the viewing public says they like is polar opposite to who they actually watch.
Posted by: mrogi | July 21, 2009 at 12:34 PM
'...nobody gives a shit about this but a few on this blog...'
Obviously it arose enough interest in you to make a comment...ergo?
Posted by: Duffman | July 21, 2009 at 12:37 PM
Duff, Jen may be a great organizer but she needs to curb that cackle. I like her but she should laugh less.
And I'm not as harsh on TBTL as I used to be. They had a really good Michael Jackson tribute. And I'm no Jackson fan; I just found it interesting.
DT, I can't imagine not having a demand for radio. Different technology, of course. But always a desire by people for audible content.
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 12:38 PM
My age group? I've given my age group away many, many times, Mr. Ryder. You haven't been paying attention.
Hope all is well. I helped a friend (older than me) clear out her deceased sister's house. She lost her job, too, and took early retirement - social security - in order to meet her rent. It was the only way she could do it. This was in Portland.
She's always been frugal and is doing okay. But the economy down there is worse than up here. I don't know why unemployment wasn't an option...I know that she had to quit her recently acquired job to care for her sister so maybe she wasn't eligible.
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 12:54 PM
Did you guys just hear that funding for the F-22 was voted down in Congress against the wishes of Cantwell and Murray?
I'm glad. Murray and Cantwell may no longer be touch with the public on this. That money could just as well put people to work building roads and repairing infrastructure as building planes that nobody wants.
Might be time for a change. Hong Tran - where are you?
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 01:04 PM
http://www.930kbai.com/
Posted by: Coiler | July 21, 2009 at 01:22 PM
ryder
glad to see you're doing better and not letting the sob's keep you down.
Posted by: Puget Sound | July 21, 2009 at 01:32 PM
Yes but how many/who covers local issues.
Posted by: Duffman | July 21, 2009 at 01:33 PM
We get Ed on KPTK 1090 AM right now. Yes, Duffman and I apparently agree on more diversity.
In fact, Ed's got a great caller right now who is repeating what he heard on Fox at 11 AM yesterday and Ed's going to check it out. Then the caller went on to generalize about how everyone can't be like liberals and progressives without any specifics on how we're different. Good conversation which is clearly showing the ignorance (and I mean ignorance and not idiocy) of these people who watch Fox.
Ed is so good with these people.
Coiler, you hear that?
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 01:43 PM
I'm listening to the randi stream right now
Posted by: Coiler | July 21, 2009 at 01:48 PM
KIRO can't even hold a contest correctly. Back when they were incessantly begging you to switch to FM, they had a contest where you would get $1000 if you called in and said you had switched. But the commercial that told you to call in was broadcast on AM and FM. A smart station would have broadcast the commercial only on FM, that way, you would have to be listening to FM in order to win.
Posted by: don | July 21, 2009 at 03:23 PM
"That money could just as well put people to work building roads and repairing infrastructure as building planes that nobody wants."
Or pay for the unemployment benefits for the 24,000 people who will lose thier job.
Posted by: nevets | July 21, 2009 at 03:33 PM
I still like Dave Ross, he's a bit of a milquetoast and a lightweight but not so much that I won't listen.
The problem is the damn reception...I live in a valley west of Chehalis, no way can I pick up KIRO FM, so I stream it. However, when I'm in the car, and that's when the majority of my radio listening takes place, 97.3 is often so hard to get in that I give up trying.
Posted by: Upton | July 21, 2009 at 03:42 PM
So why is it such a big deal that KIRO is on FM? KBSG was a market leader for 20 years using exactly the same signal (97.3) The argument that by switching to FM KIRO isn't powerful enough to pull in an audience is rediculous. I live in Centralia and can pick it up just fine.
Posted by: Dave | July 21, 2009 at 03:43 PM
They can work at WalShit*
Posted by: Coiler | July 21, 2009 at 03:46 PM
I didn't know you started a retail chain there coiler. I hope Walmart doesn't sue you for infringing on thier name like Starbucks did a few years ago to that Portland coffee shop.
Posted by: nevets | July 21, 2009 at 04:09 PM
Upton, would that be the Willamette River valley? Beautiful!
Dave, signals seem pretty good up and down I-5. Try moving into the mountains and hills or behind them. We don't all live in cities, you know.
And Steven, seems to me you missed the point. Put them to work rebuilding infrustructure. Or possibly Boeing could put their designers to work and design something that works or that people want.
I thought you were anti-socialism?
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 05:09 PM
I just realized I meant to say Willapa, not Willamette. The Willapa River. Sorry.
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 05:27 PM
I can't get 710 where I live, let alone the FM station. I dont like any of the programming on KIROFM, joanie. I got tired of Dave Ross not doing his homework and letting misinformation and blatant lies by his guests go unquestioned. Local stories are great and necessary for Seattle residents, but they are not interesting to me. They lost me a long time ago, though, because of all the annoying commercials. Advertisers need to know that a lot of people wont by stuff from a company that yells at them.
I have been streaming KTLK in LA recently as well as listening to some of Ed in the afternoon. There are thousands of radio stations out there on the net and I love to listen to different regions of the country.
In the car, in the summer I listen to music...and to Stephanie Miller on my way to school during the rest of the year. Sunday mornings I listen to NPR, and I try to catch Vinyl Cafe when I can on Saturdays. I also listen to podcasting of Peter B. Collins, and sometimes to Karel, and sometimes to archived shows of Ray Taliaferro.
Posted by: sparky | July 21, 2009 at 06:27 PM
Thom Hartmann talked about that F-22 deal this morning. Apparently the Pentagon doesn't want them,,,they are not as up to date as other planes, and are a nightmare to maintain--them's Pentagon words, not mine. So they went to Obama and said, please, no more F-22. Meanwhile, Patty Murray, the best friend of Boeing and Lockheed, still attempted to get Congress to approve funding for them, even in the face of a veto. And Maria is on the fence about health care funding..yet there was no question in her mind that money could go for planes the Pentagon doesn't want.
Posted by: sparky | July 21, 2009 at 06:34 PM
Actually, you've posted before what you like. I just don't get that you don't understand what some of us like about KIRO. It all gets repetitive. Whether you like KIRO or not, some of us do . . . or did. It is a major player in this area.
I knew about Cantwell and Murray, thus my comment above. Murray has pushed for several programs benefitting this area that have gone seriously awry. I applaud her desire to maintain jobs, but she should be looking to support and encourage rebuilding our infrastructure and encourage start-ups esp. in the area of energy.
Perhaps it is all window dressing so that she can say she tried.
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 06:53 PM
"are not as up to date as other planes, and are a nightmare to maintain--them's Pentagon words"
Yeah right Sparky. Those sound like Lib words. For one, they are the newest ones out there having outperformed 4th generation fighters everytime. As for maintenance, there hasn't been enough flight time to get an accurate cost. You Libs will say anything to degrade this countrys military, as shown by excon calling those who died in Iraq, died in vain.
As for those who will lose thier jobs, well I spoke to soon. It looks like the most jobs will move over to the F-35 although some estimates say 2,000 will be laidoff.
And Joanie,
"Put them to work rebuilding infrustructure."
That would be like telling you to quit your job and work with me at Walmart. Why do you think unemployment is still high? If you look at the papers you will still see help wanted adds by the hundreds. You think these guys are going to start hauling cement bags or wood for money. No, these engineers have made thier money, they have put away over the years and now they can wait for the recession to end all the while collecting unemployment. And how is collecting something you contributed into socialism. Do you consider interest paid on bank accounts socialism.
Posted by: nevets | July 21, 2009 at 10:23 PM
Sorry, Steven. Nobody is guaranteed a job. You're old enough to know that. Not in a capitalist society. Maybe a socialist one...
And we aren't only talking about engineers here. Machinists, laborers, clerical - all will be affected and Boeing has paid into unemployment so they will get it. But, many of them would rather work. And if that means changing what they do, the ambitious ones will.
Whatever you think Boeing employees should do, we need to repair infrustructure and I don't care who does it.
Or would you rather see some more bridges fall down?
Posted by: joanie | July 21, 2009 at 11:49 PM
Steven..your hero John McCain noted yesterday during the short debate over the F-22 that it had never flown over Iraq or Afghanistan, that it doesn't do well in rain. He noted that the Pentagon doesn't want it and said he would vote to drop it.
Posted by: sparky | July 22, 2009 at 09:02 AM
Yes, McCain is in the fix now. You too can be a greeter at
WalMart
Posted by: Coiler | July 22, 2009 at 09:15 AM
Whoooooo re-coil you are cruel.
Posted by: Duffman | July 22, 2009 at 09:39 AM
Chris Hedges coming on Ross. Even if you don't like Ross, Hedges is an excellent interview and sure knows all there is to know about war.
Posted by: joanie | July 22, 2009 at 10:59 AM
I meant to say the politics of war.
Posted by: joanie | July 22, 2009 at 11:00 AM
...as well as the war of politics (was just listening to him...on my little jog) [smile]
Posted by: Duffman | July 22, 2009 at 11:21 AM
Now, turn it to Ed on 1090. He's kicking booty on healthcare again. He's doing it senator by senator and congressman by congressman. Nobody is working harder or putting the push to politicians like he is.
If only people would listen. Call our reps and senators and tell them to stay in DC until they get it done.
This is just so important.
senate contact information
contact info for all legislators
If you want them to know how important this is and to work like we do until the job is done, call.
Posted by: joanie | July 22, 2009 at 12:29 PM
I heard he was going to have a rep from Canada on his show to fact check the repugs claims of shitty health care.
Posted by: Coiler | July 22, 2009 at 12:54 PM
He was, but as it turns out the rep from Canada actually checked into a local hospital for adequate needed care.
Posted by: Duffman | July 22, 2009 at 01:03 PM
that is something you will never see on Fux News...fortunately, there are a number of conservatives in Ed's listening audience...maybe that will help.
Posted by: sparky | July 22, 2009 at 01:05 PM