take your answer off the air...

  • HorsesAss.Org: the straight poop on WA politics & the press
    progressive brilliance from the guy who pointed out Tim Eyman's nascent horse's-assedness
  • Talker's Magazine
    The quirky talk radio trade mag. Check the Talk Radio Research Project- it's not very scientific, but places on the top 15 talkers list (scroll down to Talk Radio Audiences By Size)) are as hotly contested as Emmys (and mean just about as much).
  • The Advocate
    No, not THAT Advocate... it's the Northwest Progressive Institute's Official Blog.
  • Media Matters
    Documentation of right-wing media in video, audio and text.
  • Orcinus
    home of David Neiwert, freelance investigative journalist and author who writes extensively about far-right hate groups
  • Hominid Views
    "People, politics, science, and whatnot" Darryl is a statistician who fights imperialism with empiricism, gives good links and wry commentary.
  • Jesus' General
    An 11 on the Manly Scale of Absolute Gender, a 12 on the Heavenly Scale of the 10 Commandments and a 6 on the earthly scale of the Immaculately Groomed.
  • Howie in Seattle
    Howie Martin is the Abe Linkin' of progressive Seattle.
  • Streaming Radio Guide
    Hellishly long (5795!) list of radio streaming, steaming on the Internets.
  • The Naked Loon
    News satire -- The Onion in the Seattle petunia patch.
  • Irrational Public Radio
    "informs, challenges, soothes and/or berates, and does so with a pleasing vocal cadence and unmatched enunciation. When you listen to IPR, integrity washes over you like lava, with the pleasing familiarity of a medium-roast coffee and a sensible muffin."
  • The Maddow Blog
    Here's the hyper-interactive La Raych of MSNBC. daily show-vids, freakishly geeky research, and classy graphics.
  • Northwest Broadcasters
    The AM, FM, TV and digital broadcasters of Northwest Washington, USA and Southwest British Columbia, Canada. From Kelso, WA to the northern tip of Vancouver Island, BC - call letters, formats, slogans, networks, technical data, and transmitter maps. Plus "recent" news.
  • News Corpse
    The Internet's chronicle of media decay.
  • The Moderate Voice
    The voice of reason in the age of Obama, and the politics of the far-middle.
  • News Hounds
    Dogged dogging of Fox News by a team who seems to watch every minute of the cable channel so you don't have to.
  • HistoryLink
    Fun to read and free encyclopedia of Washington State history. Founded by the late Walt Crowley, it's an indispensable tool and entertainment source for history wonks and surfers alike.

right-wing blogs we like

  • The Reagan Wing
    Hearin lies the real heart of Washington State Republicans. Doug Parris runs this red-meat social conservative group site which bars no holds when it comes to saying who they are and who they're not; what they believe and what they don't; who their friends are and where the rest of the Republicans can go. Well-written, and flaming.
  • Orbusmax
    inexhaustible Drudgery of NW conservative news
  • The Radio Equalizer
    prolific former Seattle KVI, KIRO talk host speaks authoritatively about radio.
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« Debate pre-blame is blazing... for gwen ifill! | Main | Shannyn Moore: sarah palin lied, and she could be impeached »

October 02, 2008



Love that picture...Pizza and the debate here. I will be counting the number of times she says:

Media Bias
Gotcha Question
Bad guys
Guys and Gals

I would suggest a drinking game of taking a sip every time she drops the "g" from her words, but that would lead to alcohol poisoning...will stick to Pepsi.


Oh, and then, lets count how many right wingers say that Joe Biden was "too tough on her" "a bully" "a sexist" or "condescending."


That bully should just back off and quit bullying our Sarah. That male chauvenist pig needs to get off of his sexist high horse ands show a little respect.
(but I really do think she will do just fine)


Ya betcha, this darn time limit is just soo golly darn frustratin' to me cuz I want ta tell the 'merican people about my record as mayor!

Gay Gary

Pizza and the debate here.

The food of the proletariat accompanied by a 2-party infomercial targeted to the mind-wiped.

You guys never let me down!


You Dem snotnoses can make fun of her countrified speaking all you want, but our gal Sarah is kicking old Joes'ass!

Gay Gary

LMAO! I did enjoy Palin going: "Well there 'ya go, Joe, dog gone it, looking backward again, schucks!" and Joe Biden giggled and blushed and squirmed around like he was the Pillsbury Dough Boy!


Biden just blew her out of the water with his expose of their 'maverick' claim.


You dont have to believe me...the hundred or so uncommitted voters on CNN made that little graph do quite a dance.

I am not foolish enough to think I can change anyone's mind, ( and Gary isnt able to discuss without insults, anyway) about who scored more points and Im not even going to try.I will just say that tonight
I was very proud of Joe Biden and I thought Gwen was an awesome moderator. She should do ALL the debates.

Gay Gary

Sparkplug, there's a difference between mean insults and mean truths.

But, I also thought Gwen did as good of a job as could be expected hosting the infomercial between Joe "Bottom 2/3s" Biden (D-Scranton) and Sarah "Open Legs" Palin.


I do not see a victory for either of them beyond Palin not screwing up. She did hold her own against Biden.
It was good to hear that old Joe would be in on all meetings with Obambam. No doubt there would need to be an adult in the room.
GG, I would be with you on Barr, but the thought of Obambam, Peelosi and Harry Reid being in charge of this nation unopposed is scary beyond any thing politicaly that I can think of. No thanks.

Gay Gary

Sorry, I ditched Barr two weeks ago after the dust-up at the National Press Club and his continued inability to take a strong stand against the Patriot Act and FISA. I'm now voting Chuck Baldwin (even in light of his religious zealotry).


What happened to the old Gary, the one with Ochlus Blue?


Final score: Biden 28 - Palin 7.

Palin missed her second touchdown by saying "nuke-you-lur" at least 6 times.

Gay Gary

It's "Oculus Bleu" not "Ochlus Blue"!


haah the pervs over on one of my Yahoo stock boards are all atwitter over Sarah. "I want to drill Palin offshore ", "I want to lick her tits" "her nipples are hard",.....hahahahaa.


How the hell can you support The Constitution Party candidate? Next thing you know, you will be wanting common sense back in our gummint.
I admire you for your convictions. I just don't see me living long enough to survive the damage to be done by Obambam, Peelosi and Harry.


Who is "Oculus" voting for? Can we count on him to throw his vote away?


Palin mispronounced nuclear six or seven times, but she more than held her own against Biden, who played fast and loose with the facts (that's for me to know and Ph(Jo)anie and others to find out). Hint: Try factchecker.org.

Looks like McCain/Palin will get some voters back and it will probably be horse race next week after the omnibus rescue bill passes. I suggest the McCain campaign focuses on exposing the corruption and fascist tactics (but not call them fascist) and phoniness of the Obama campaign, and there are plenty of evidence out there. The MSM did not get to play their despicable game of editing out her decent responses - which is what they would do in Chavez's Venezuela - I wish them to go choke on their own vomit !

I had reservations about the debate moderator beforehand, and after all the flack she received, she was reasonable - except for a few partisan exposures in some of her questions.

Gay Gary

Who are you voting for Coiler?

Are you voting for the candidate who voted for FISA, who voted for the Patriot Act, who supports "clean coal", who supports offshore oil drilling, who believes in manmade global warming, who wants a minimum of 80,000 troops in Iraq through 2010, who voted for the $700B bailout?

Since I just described both candidates the real question is: can we count on you to throw your vote away?

From the great scene in "Moon Over Parador", are you voting Alfons "Red" Sims or Alfons "Blue" Sims?

This is the problem with democracy. You give peasants voting rights and they suddenly think they're statesman of the highest order.

Gay Gary

The way to control peasants is to create the illusion that they have some control over their meaningless little lives. Let them choose between chocolate and vanilla ice cream, it doesn't matter, Baskin & Robbins wins either way. The little peasants will just feel content and happy that they got to "exercise my gull-durn right to choose - and if I don't like vanilla, I can CHANGE, dag dummit! That's why 'merica is gosh-durn good! Freedom!"

Oh you poor, silly fools.

The bird fights its way out of the egg. The egg is the world. He who would be born must first destroy a world. The bird flies to God. God's name is Abraxas.


Ouch, that will leave a mark, maybe a scar. I have to go get a bandage.

Gay Gary

I am quite clearly so intellectually AND PHYSICALLY superior to everyone on this blog I don't even know why I come here sometimes. It's totally exasperating.

In the 6 or so months I've been visiting this place I haven't even managed to recruit anyone to join OB and me in a 3-way for chrissakes.


Palin has invented her own language; one that is full of words but doesn't say anything. If I had the time I would tabulate the number of times that her "answers" did not relate to the question. She is quite skilled at this. This could be quite scary, were she to be Vice President.


if you can't dazzle them with brilliance...


Not anything that ever intrigued me there Gary. Maybe we can go out some Friday night and try to pick up a nice couple.


As I re-look at the old tevo, I have to rethink my first impression. As one that watches with great interest, k-9's I think that when a pit bull in lip stick meets a man with white eye shadow, the pit bull wins.
Sorry Joe, you lose. Go away.


Yes, we should have corporations running the country, like Bayer

Gay Gary

Disgusting Teachers

Now while I don't support free public education past the age of 14 (aside from an optional year of vocational training in an industrial skill) I do think some non-partisan civics education is worthwhile but certainly not by these teachers.

Gay Gary

Yes, we should have corporations running the country, like Bayer

I hope that's not directed to me. I've been pretty blunt on this blog in my criticism of Bayer and forthcoming about my membership in the ICSPP and CCHR.

Many modern psychiatrists and pharmacists learn national socialist (Nazi) ideology in medical school. I'm not speaking in hyperbole, they are taught actual Nazi theory.

In an ideal America we would convene Nuremberg-type trials for every single board-certified psychiatrist in this country. This is one area where I make a reluctant exception to my non-support for capital punishment.

Gay Gary

Oh, BTW, anyone wanna guess what I think about the "mental health parity" provisions of the new $700B bailout McBama voted on? LMAO.

Coiler for baby asprin

You said the 'peasants' have too much democracy. Maybe we should let real fascism in.

Gay Gary

Coiler, you don't even know what the word Fascism means.


"Thats Drill, baby drill"

Got that Joe, this way Joey can afford to fill his gas tank up.


I do, unfortunately, it creeps in. If your persona is a gay, fascist then put up or shut up I say.

poll cat

Palin did OK, made the R's feel better about her. At least she does alright as a trained monkey- they were worried that she couldn't even be that after last week. She'll disappear onto the campaign trail, give no more interviews... Bet the trends haven't changed though.


A wink and charm
rehearsed with alarm
nothing said
except "forged" and "maverick"

"government get out of the way" like it has been for the last eight years?

McCain and Palin are the history that she so detests.

"Teachers need to be paid more" - so what's the federal gov going to do about that?

I wonder when was the last time Sarah held her baby?

I've never heard anyone more rehearsed and unable to sound authentic or spontaneous on any level in my life.

Her closing remarks were the real Sarah. She started out pretty good but ended wandering around and the real Sarah leaked through.

But, then, a wink and charm is what the conservatives buy when they vote for anything. Just ask charmin' chucks. He and Sarah talk the same language.

The second half of that debate - when Biden finally showed some passion and quit smiling that toothy grin - was the win. He took her down with plain talk about human issues. She just kept talking. He said something. Great job, Joe.

Gay Gary

I do, unfortunately, it creeps in. If your persona is a gay, fascist then put up or shut up I say.

What do fascists think about consumerism and industrial economics? What is the fascist view of class? To what school of international relations theory do fascists subscribe?

You have no idea what Fascism is; you think Fascism is an extreme-right ideology. Fascism exists beyond the political spectrum as a perverse conglomeration of five otherwise innocent ideologies.

But it is nothing but a buzzword to you; bereft and absent of any meaning or understanding.

Tacoma Taxpayer

There were times when BOTH of them didn't answer the question. The commentator even said that early on, "neither one of you answered the question", we'll come back to it.

So she says nuclear wrong. Big Deal. What about people in the South part of the U.S. who drawl? Does that mean they don't say a word right?

Everybody giving her hell for not talking to the press. Where the hell has Biden been hiding?


I apologize for doubting the moderator on an earlier post. She couldn't help Joe tonight. Nobody could.


I like Gov Palin and I dislike Sen Biden. With that premise ingrained I tried to watch the debate as objectively as possible and I came away with this.
It became evident soon into the debate that we were dealing with competency versus personality, and while Gov Palin certainly trumpts in the latter we as an American public want the former in a VPOTUS who is that proverbial heartbeat away. Sen Biden, with his obvious experience and grasp of International affairs and the fact that he's learned all the political ground rules and knows his way around - won the competency test. In my view, he had to stay away from two important foopahs: 1. condescention and 2. bloviating. While he didn't completely avoid the latter, he controlled it and there was no evidence of the former, so he kept from destroying himself. Gov Palin won the personality test and 'capturing the American imagination' test but that's not good enough for prime time in a Presidential election.
Alas, like (I believe Sparky said herein before) I fear Gov Palin may go down in the annals of American History as a SNL parody and could have well even damaged her 'staying power' as Governor of Alaska. This does not reflect well on Sen McCain in his ability to make wise choices and I think the polls will continue to swing. Those lite-blue states will now turn fully blue and the electoral count will soon be obvious.
It WILL be an Obama administration.
Gov Palin I applaud you for giving it a heck of a try, you are indeed a talented person with much to offer. History will record you as the first Republican VP candidate and you will now fade into the background much like your Democrat counter-part G. Ferraro. I wish you the best in your future for yourself and your beautiful family. I pray your son, along with all our other troops remain safe.
Like I said, barring an unusual high-impact October surprise favoring the McCain camp,I consider this race over. BUH-bye!


"10:48: On Fox News, Hume just said Palin is “physically attractive.” In the past, the McCain campaign has said that Democrats commenting on Palin’s appearance are being sexist. Prominent conservatives have called Palin “hot” and “attractive” previously.

10:45: On MSNBC, Pat Buchanan is quite vehemently insisting that Palin “wiped the floor” with Joe Biden whom he described as “boring.” Rachel Maddow tried to press Buchanan on whether Palin’s various factual errors were relevant, but Buchanan dismissed these concerns as “picayune.”

10:44: On Fox News, Mort Kondracke admitted that Palin is not ready to be president. Regarding Biden, he said, “If he had to move into the presidency on the basis of experience…he’s better qualified than she is by a long shot.”

10:43: CNN analysts discussed Palin’s vagueness. “I think at the beginning of the debate, Sarah Palin’s problem was that she wasn’t answering questions directly,” Campbell Brown said, while another CNN pundit, Hillary Rosen, said of Palin’s discussion of the economy, “I don’t think she really substantively gave answers.”

10:40: On Fox News, Mort Kondracke described Palin as “feisty” and claimed she didn’t make any mistakes or verbal errors – Brit Hume had to correct him.

10:39: CNN’s Campbell Brown said she didn’t see the debate as a “game-changer.” She said of Palin, “The second half on foreign policy, she did seem a little out of her depth. It’s not her area of expertise, and it often felt like she was reciting memorized talking points. I thought Biden showed remarkable self-restraint throughout the evening…for example when she got the name of Gen. McKiernan wrong.”

10:38: On Fox News, Brit Hume asked Bill Kristol what he thought of the debate. He laughed and responded, “Well, I’m so biased…”

10:36: CBS’s Bob Schieffer: “I found it disconcerting, time and again Governor Palin chose not to answer the question.”


10:35: Palin said we’re now at pre-surge troop levels in Iraq. This is wrong. There were 130,000 troops in Iraq before the surge. Today, there are 147,000 troops in Iraq. (UPDATE: McCain made this same error in June.)"

The only people that are still sold on Palin is that ever-loyal Bush base.


Lotta "maverick" references there. Being from Texas I should point out that a Samuel Augustus Maverick is the source of this word, who let his calves run loose without any political, economic, military or emotional restraint, never mind a brand.

Just cut 'em loose and hope for the best.


It's regrettable our country's expectations have sunk to the point that Palin's "success" as prospective Vice President of the United States of America is measured by how little she tripped up in repeating rehearsed stock answers and anecdotes regardless of their relevancy to the debater's question. Clearly, this was as her Republican handlers taught her to do. They offend us all by believing that Americans are too foolish to realize she not only hasn't given any substance, but has completely evaded the question. She simply threw out messages she was instructed to while simultaneously doing the budding of the Republican elite puppeteers -- like when she says she represents America's "middle class," while accusing Biden of "wealth redistribution" for the top 5% of taxpayers back to the rates they were paying under relatively prosperous Reagan years. Americans will realize that while they may indeed want to sit down and enjoy a cup of coffee with Palin and laugh about goofy things, they would not place the fate of a real nation -- much less OUR nation -- in her hands.

Democrats in '08

Sarah Palin's performance was appalling. In violation of the debate commission rules, she intentionaly ignored questions and changed the topics. In speaking to her talking points, she mislead, distorted and lied about the records of Obama, Biden, McCain and her own. For Sarah Palin, this was less a debate, as intended and more an theatrical exercise in presenting rehearsed material drilled into her by the Bush/Cheney adminstration handlers who programmed her for the "big show", just as they prepared her speeches for the Republic National Convention. She showed no ability to think an her feet. She "played" to the non-intellect of the audience, while avoiding tough, complex issues. The true debater was Senator Biden, who instilled confidence by addressing all questions with directness, honesty, substance and boldness. He proved he is up to the challenge of being President of the United States, while she provided the freightening portrait of a candidate lacking the right level of preparation, understanding of issues, honesty, knowledge and right experience necessary for the office.

It was truly an evening marked by the contrast of substance versus burlesque.

Sarah Palin proved to be the candidate of Bush-think, and extension of the failures of the past eight years.

Senator Joe Biden proved to be leader America needs.

mark underwood

In a real debate with a more instant fact check as one would have around a conference table while discussing policy issues in a serious and intelligent analysis of the options, I sincerely doubt that Palin or McCain could hold their own.

This was not a contest of intelligence and depth of knowledge: it was cocktail party chatter where Biden had to tone down his knowledge and Palin had to smile prettily and flirt.


Gov. Palin repeated the lie that when Mr. McCain said the fundamentals of America's economy are strong, that he was (allegedly) referring to work ethic and output.
Sorry, but when economists talk about the fundamentals of an economy, it is NEVER, NEVER, NEVER about "how much the people want to work" and "how willing they are." It is about interest rates, inventory levels, exchange rates, availability of credit, and a host of other technical criteria.


So Mark, Biden had to tone down his knowledge by lying on several occasions?
The man is smart but Biden can't hide Obama's shortcomings with half-truths and lies. His voting record, contradictions with himself and lack of executive experience were well illustrated by the hick-chick from the north.


And the MSM will insure the 14 documented lies Biden told are not to be discussed.

Check on the CNN poll and the difficulty of voting for Palin but not Biden. I know, I know, just an unfortunate tech glitch.


The facts won't matter to the the Obama voters Habu, this is all about style and catch phrases for them.

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