UPDATED: Bonneville blows up oldies KBSG to simulcast KIRO- will KIRO go all sports?

This thing of the past -- oldies station B97.3 -- will truly become a thing of the past.

This from Carl Gardner, Bonneville Seattle Market Manager:

... We know there are a significant number of radio listeners who use FM on a daily basis, but may visit the AM dial only sporadically. In addition, we also know that as the music radio landscape has become more and more fragmented, it's clear that there will be a limited available audience for KBSG's music programming. Puget Sound listeners have shown great support for the quality news and stimulating talk on 710 KIRO. This is why KIRO has been a perennial audience leader in the region. We believe we can best serve Puget Sound Residents by instead offering News Talk 710 KIRO's rich mix of news, local talk, public affairs, and community service on 97.3 FM. Therefore, we will begin simulcasting KIRO on FM 97.3 and AM 710 beginning at 5am, Tuesday, August 12th. Again, thank you for being a loyal KBSG listener.  I hope you continue to listen to the KIRO programming on 97.3 FM. Sincerely,

We reported rumors to this effect last month -- more rumors persist that with the Seahawks already in hand, and the recent acquisition of Mariners' baseball broadcasting, KIRO AM will morph into all sports.

Here are two fairly brilliant observations from two of our fairly brilliant readers:

This from our friend Rev:

Consider what's really happening here:

1) Bonneville is shutting down one of their Seattle program streams. One assumes they are also eliminating some jobs, both on-air and in sales.

2) They're placing the KIRO program stream on two transmitters. Unless this produces a larger share or cume of the total radio audience in this market, they can't charge more for commercial time.

3) The #1 news and talk station in this market is FM (KUOW). So one must assume that the news/talk audience knows how to operate the AM/FM switches on their radios.

4) So it's likely that most of the "new" KIRO-FM audience will switch over from AM. Minimal gain BlatherWatcher  numbers equals minimal increased revenue.

5) Which suggests that the simulcast is only temporary. A new format on one of the duplicated transmitters will (one assumes) grab at least some new that audience Bonneville can sell separately.

So it seems likely that this is not the last chapter in this particular shift of transmitters and formats.

This is from RadioWonkLance, a Seattle ex-pat living in Toronto

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but read the FAQ on the mynorthwest.com site carefully

It says that the Seahawks will be heard this coming season on 710 and 97.3.

However, it says that the Mariners will be on 710, no mention of 97.3.   Do we smell TBTL on FM and the Mariners on AM?

Also, I found this interesting at the end:

Q: Where else can I hear the music B97.3 played?
A: 95.7 KJR or 102.5 KZOK"

It's not every day that one promotes someone else's radio stations. 

Comments

[Duffman]

EXCELLENT!!! Thanks Bla'M.

[Ray]

I had a feeling this format change was coming. The "oldies" format is getting harder and harder to maintain in large markets like Seattle. Moving 97.3 to all sports would also create some great competition for KJR with its stronger, cleaner signal.

[AuthenticAndrew]

It makes sense to move more talk to FM since local talk is the one thing terestrial radio still has going for it. National news and talk is available on XM, music is available on iPods.

I'm quite worried that most of what I want to hear will be pre-empted by sports. I hate sports, it's the equivelent of static. KIRO is going to become a station that breaks at random for hours at a time.

Dori has a niche following of people who can tolerate his numerous personal insecurities and are willing to listen to AM in order to find him, but Dave Ross really has a broader appeal and I think he would do better with FM listeners who happen upon the station. I don't think the average FM listener wants to hear about local government in any context whatsoever.

[joanie]

It says "simulcast." I wonder if they can monitor the listenership to see which band draws the most listeners? Then make further changes...

[Wild Bill]

Authentic Andrew, Sir, well NPR KUOW has the biggest audience in the Seattle market, slightly more than a six, and they do their fair share of local politics. Of course, the music crowds, be it the 106.9 or the 93.3 variety probably don't care, as they're either in the dentist chair, or enjoying suummer activities in groups of twenty to thirty. I'd love to hear Ross's baritone in FM, and tbtl is a natural with all the music they use. Dori is fantastic with his Seahawks stuff, on either frequency. Dori is becoming the only sane voice of logic in Seattle politics. Ron & Don can work just fine in either band, as well; their drivetime numbers are very impressive. This is a huge, positive move by Bonneville....Bonneville is the leading innovator in this market. On a sidebar, Ross's 30 year show this AM was a nice trip down Radio memory lane.

[AuthenticAndrew]

I couldn't listen to it, it was just way too irrelevant. I listen to talk radio for news and commentary about news. I know it's a rare special occasion but the navel gazing was killing me.

[Gay Gary]

innovator in this market

Did somebody say innovator? LOL. Sorry, that word launches me into my regular speel ...

I thought Entercom simulcast KIRO for a year or so in the late '80's? I barely recall as I was in junior high at the time but I'm 89% certain.

I do know for certain that TBTL, love it or hate it, is nothing really "innovative". Billy Bush has been doing no-calls, entertainment talk with a judgmental sidekick for a few years, as have others.

Bonneville has the Mariners now ... a state of affairs that was a repeat of the '90s and past.

Bonneville got a website with a blogging capability, there's no arguing that. Welcome to 1998.

Anyway, for the imploding medium of radio perhaps pulling out some recipe cards from the 1989 drawer of the idea file is the most we can hope for in the innovative category and I'm happy with that. If it pushes back the inevitable from 2013 to 2015 or so, sure, why not?

[Gay Gary]

I take that back - I just googled it, it was the station currently known as "the Wolf" that simulcast KIRO on FM and it was in the 90s apparently.

In any case, these frivolous and cosmetic changes - putting lipstick on a pig - is guaranteeing the permanent irrelevance of radio for all time.
Radio is on life support in the intensive care ward but all the doctors are too busy in pediatrics, making balloon animals for the kids who've just had their tonsils removed, to be bothered with treating the poor old guy.

Didn't Jim French used to broadcast from atop the Space Needle, his face plastered over billboards across the county? Now radio is about squeezing out an extra 3 or 4 listeners from a low 5-digit audience broadcasting out of an aging brick building*.

* well, to be fair, I've never seen KIROs building in person, just in a photo in the PI once but it looked aging

[Gay Gary]

This seemed like an interesting thread, I wanted to follow it but I'll be without internet for the rest of the week so I did just want to say, so that I don't leave on a completely negative note, that I think what ABC Radio is doing with Fame Games is really the closest anyone's come to seeing actual innovation in radio and it's a real shame no stations in the Seattle market are carrying it.

[Rev]

Consider what's really happening here:

1) Bonneville is shutting down one of their Seattle program streams. One assumes they are also eliminating some jobs, both on-air and in sales.

2) They're placing the KIRO program stream on two transmitters. Unless this produces a larger share or cume of the total radio audience in this market, they can't charge more for commercial time.

3) The #1 news and talk station in this market is FM (KUOW). So one must assume that the news/talk audience knows how to operate the AM/FM switches on their radios.

4) So it's likely that most of the "new" KIRO-FM audience will switch over from AM. Minimal gain in numbers equals minimal increased revenue.

5) Which suggests that the simulcast is only temporary. A new format on one of the duplicated transmitters will (one assumes) grab at least some new that audience Bonneville can sell separately.

So it seems likely that this is not the last chapter in this particular shift of transmitters and formats.

[RadioWonkLance]

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but read the FAQ on the mynorthwest.com site carefully.

It says that the Seahawks will be heard this coming season on 710 and 97.3.

However, it says that the Mariners will be on 710, no mention of 97.3. Do we smell TBTL on FM and the Mariners on AM?

Also, I found this interesting at the end:
"Q: Where else can I hear the music B97.3 played?
A: 95.7 KJR or 102.5 KZOK"

It's not every day that one promotes someone else's radio stations.

[sparky]

Really? Can't say I have ever heard the Beach Boys on KZOK.

[Duffman]

Beach Boys?...Ugh! sparky are you a Huey Lewis fan?

[Coiler]

Kiro had a talk format on FM called The Buzz--they pulled the plug on that one.

[joanie]

But it was n competition with their AM line up.

Perhaps they are trying to appeal to that FM audience esp. with TBTL and then, as Rev says, switch some formats on AM or see what happens and then decide. I'm sure the AM audience loyal to Ross and Monson would move to FM.

[RobP]

>>But it was n competition with their AM line up<<

Entercom pulled the plug on the Buzz because it
was cannibalizing KISW, not KIRO. Plus they saw an opportunity to take on KMPS who at the time had no direct competitor.

[joanie]

Thanks, Ron. I didn't know that. Which station was doing better? Wasn't the Buss highly profitable?

I doubt anyone cares but me; however, here's a really good interview with Ross Rocky Anderson, former mayor of Salt Lake City who was at the Kucinich impeachment hearings. A very interesting insightful discussion.

Half way through the program if you should listen.

discussion of unitary presidency

Doesn't take long.

[Coiler]

I recall KNBQ moved it's transmitter to Capitol Pk reaching into Seattle area before the Wolf was created.

[Gay Gary]

Joanie - the loyal D you are, I'm surprised you're referencing Rocky, since he's endorsed Ralph Nader? I thought, in D vernacular, the loonies who support Nader are boorish and egomaniacal, not insightful and interesting! ;)

[joanie]

If you'd listen to his take on this and let me know you thoughts, I know you better, Gigi.

I have tangled with myself over this whole thing. Truthfully, Ralph Nader has been spot on since the beginning. The problem this country has been facing for decades is the take over by corporations.

Unfortunately, he's become a caricature of himself.

But, you know, people have to be trampled on before they realize what they've lost and how hard it is going to be to get it back.

Even good Dems are guilty of tunnel vision. They think the least of two poor choices is better than letting the worst choice in. I'm not so sure.

I believe Obama will turn out to be a real agent of change. But that is based more on instinct than concrete proof.

If you guys actually vote McBush in, you will have the burden on your consciences for as long as you live that you put another crack in the liberty bell and allowed our democratic republic go down the drain.

I'd rather see Bob Barr or Ron Paul in there before McBush.

Rocky put it so well. We are one Justice away from a unitary presidency which is synonymous with dictatorship.

He and Bruce Fein say it much better than I can. But I march to the beat of my own drum and I am not now nor have ever been owned by party.

[joanie]

You know, gigi, you'd like Peter B. His politics are definitely 180 from yours but you'd like his style. I think so, anyway.

And he's got an awesome tax-deductible record collection. That's what he calls it.

He's smart, witty, calm and clever.

[joanie]

Wow! Peter B. is interviewing an Ohio attorney who is talking about the ongoing investigation in 2004. Did you guys know that Karl Rove apparently threatened Mike Connell, the IT Specialist in the Republican party, if he doesn't take the fall for the corruption in the 2004 election?

Veddy interesting.

"Peter B Collins 7/25/08 H3
Brad Friedman from Bradblog.com. Cliff Arnebeck, attorney in Ohio, Mike Connell threatened by Rove?"

[yeehaw]

That's a bummer, I saved my aluminum welding jobs at work for when Dori was on so the high-frequency starting current would temporarily zap out his little weasel drawl. Repeated often enough, my co-worker would turn the radio off. That's just not going to cut it on FM.

[nevets]

Joanie, looks like Malloy got himself another politician to go after now. Did you hear him bash Pelosi for her comments on "The View" yeterday. It is great when the Libs eat their own.

And your

"But, you know, people have to be trampled on before they realize what they've lost and how hard it is going to be to get it back."

Like free plastic or paper grocery bags.

"We are one Justice away from a unitary presidency which is synonymous with dictatorship."

More like one Liberal President away from being a nother USSR of old.

[Coiler]

Who said Pelosi is a Lib Is Chuck Hagel a crazy neo-con?

[joanie]

paper grocery bags?

That's the extent of your vision, Steven?

USSR of old? Well, could be I suppose. They didn't have much a middle class but the guys in charge made sure they got their's now didn't they?

KBG - KBR - Blackwater - torture - Cheney - the dark side - war in Afghanistan - empire building . . .

Could be, Steven, Could be.

Pelosi was the wrong woman.

[joanie]

make that "KGB" - thanks.

[there]

and what of kjr? do folks think that listeners will automaticaly flock to kiro? for who? new york vinny? the whatshisname who does sports updates? dori? no. way.
however, if kiro were to poach the newly "liberated" groz, get a local host to rival the hopeless "softy" and put someone up against the boring "elise at night" they could make some hay...

thee

[joanie]

What happened that the groz has fallen into disrepute? He used to be the mainstay at that station.

I used to listen just for him. Voice and sports intellect.

[nevets]

And thats what you want right Joanie? Like I've said before...

Hussein Obama = Bush.

Wrong woman?

I'm confused, which freedoms were you talking about. Those are the only ones I've read about that have been taken away. Its gotta start somehow right. Good place to start with the little stuff to see if fellow Libs like yourself will buy into it doncha think. Today the bags, tomorrow?

[joanie]

You don't even make sense, Steven.

[bink]

When they came for the plastic bags, i didn't mind, for i had no plastic bags- when they came for the paper, i didn't mind...

[B97.3 Fan]

Good GOD. Do you people ever stay on the topic being presented?

Apparently in the industry, music formats are MUCH CHEAPER to run than talk ones... so I'm guessing that looking at moving the hosts from KQBZ which would share audience with KISW made sense. Hell, people still mention Tom Leykis despite him being on air (recorded) from 10 pm to 1 am. The Mens Room and BJ Shea's programs are clearly lighting up the diaries of FM radio users. And they're almost all entertainment/talk.

And yes, now KMPS has *some* direct format competition across the entire metro (c'mon KNBQ doesn't hit buildings in downtown and is scratchy in N-Seattle, central Seattle, etc). Country has broad reach for whatever reason.

[nevets]

Ah Joanie, learning quick from the first graders I see.

"No I didn't, yes you did, No I..."

[Wazzu82]

Gary:

"If you guys actually vote McBush in, you will have the burden on your consciences for as long as you live that you put another crack in the liberty bell and allowed our democratic republic go down the drain."

OMG, if the socialists are allowed more power in the country, we will no longer have a republic. But the pendulum swings and the sheeple will let socialism gain a greater foothold and within a generation or two, the US will be a socialist dictatorship.

[sparky]

At least it wont be a Republican dictatorship

[Wazzu82]

Sparky:

You've got to be kidding me! When have we ever had a Republican dictatorship? It definately is not Bush/Cheney. They have a socialist Congress checking them.

But with Obama (a/k/a, another Jimmy Carter) as president, the socialists will be just one Supreme Court justice from running our country into the ground.

[Jo]

Ron and Don said they would be missing those who walked out with boxes yesterday. I assume this is what they are talking about or was someone else let go?

[AuthenticAndrew]

Why don't you move to a politics blog if that's all you want to talk about?

In pointless posts comparing Ron O'Neill to a wrestler that's one thing but this is actualy big news.

I wish Bla'm would delete all these irrelevant posts - no, rather it's his duty to do so. He's being a negligent blogger.

[sparky]

Why not start your own blog, Andrew? That way you could control the subjects and delete anything you don't like.

Seriously..that little orange icon up at the top is a link to a generic blog form you can fill out and you just start typing.

[AuthenticAndrew]

That doesn't make any sense.

[Tommy008]

this is why Obama is going to lose. Monson just had a field day exposing twoface phony and fraud Obama after he quickly distanced himself from rapper Ludacris who recently wrote a vile campaign song for Barack on his own. Obama claimed that he didn't want his daughters listening to foul rap music. Monson then played a three year old speech where he was talking to a black audience in his ghetto patois and crowed about how he loved Snoop Dog and his 3 year old daughter sings along to one of his hit songs. The song in question talks about "niggers" an "motheruckers" and murdering people.

[Tommy008]

a headsup for anyone that like to orer payforview events. on sept 13 there will be a patforview grudge boxing match between radio peronality Danny Bonaduce an an assclown cho calls himslef Reveren Bob Levy. Bonauce, 48, former chil actor an KLSX radio taklhost in LA from 2-3 pm is a good entertaining guy who likes to work out and box a lot to keep in shape for possible confrontations withthe Bob Levy's of the worl. Levy is one of those sycophant's that hangs aroun in the booth from time to time on the Howard Stern Show. The degenerate sadistic toa Stern like to keep a stable of fools sourrouning him at all times to flatter his ego. This disagreeable, sour turd Levy walke into Bonauce's backstage room at his Celebrity Boxing event whic he hosts an trie to pick a fight with him. After caling Danny a ouchebag, Bonauce aske him to leave an Levy respone by bitchslapping him. Luckily anny's friens threw the asswipe out before he coul rack up an assault charge against Levy. Now anny has challenge this asswipe to a boxing match with gloves , rouns an all. He's spotting this pig

[Tommy008]

Bonaduce is giving Levy a roughly 50 or 60 poun weight avantage, since Levy weighs 215 and Bonaduce can't be more than 155. i can't wait to see Bonaduce flatten this Stern hangeron and toadie Levy in the first round. You can watch the bitchslap incient by googling the youtube vieo of it.

[John M.]

KBSG......gone??? Ive been listening since it went on the air in the 80's...(?)
My only compliant with the station, is that it became the "new" KBSG...& started sounding alot like KJR...Limited Oldies!!
Truly Seattle needs a station that is true oldies, from the 30's to at least 20 years back...
in this case...to 1988!!!
Culture shock might be the first reaction from listeners, but there is Sooo much good music in this time frame, not a soul would ever get tired of it.
Besides that, there would never be a worry of "repeating a song" ever, in one day.
Please don't go sports. Talk about a limited audience!!!
The (sad) John

[sparky]

KBSG was the one station I could turn to to hum along with the songs if there was nothing else to listen to.
All sports? Simulcasting KIRO AM?

meh

[Mike the Driver]

Why would KIRO go to "all sports" when KJR is all sports and the ratings in the latest RadioandRecords.com site show the following:

KOMO 4.0
KIRO AM 3.9
KBSG/KIRO FM 3.1

KVI 2.5
KJR AM All Sports 1.9

Why would they take KIRO AM ratings and try to compete w/KJR? They'd be going backwards wouldn't they? A lot of you keep saying KVI is dead, yet it has better ratings than KJR AM.

You got KRKO in Everett coming up to 50,000 watts soon and they are the ESPN affiliate like KJR. Plus KHHO in Tacoma (owned by Clear Channel/KJR parent) has Fox Sports 24/7 unless Tacoma baseball. KHHO is not even listed in the Seattle ratings! Olympia stations are.

Regardless, I still say KIRO will broadcast Seahawks first and Mariners will go to KBSG when conflicting. They did it before with KISW the other way around.

Portland has a new FM Sports station and it's ratings are not good either.

If news and talk are better, KIRO AM/FM will stick with it, I don't them simulcasting for long. I think Ron/Don, Dori, and TBTL (damn it) will show up on KBSG when Mariners interrupt their shows on AM. That way, they earn their money vs having a day off.

Wasn't it mentioned on here or in the Seattle PI/Times that the new VP for Bonneville for Seattle group has experience with sports programming? You knew it had to be coming since they don't like KBSG's ratings at 3.1 But why go to 1.9? If Bonneville goes all sports, they either have to have all live/local programming like KJR or they gonna have to take away either Fox Radio Sports or ESPN away from Clear Channel. Maybe that way we would get to hear ESPN's broadcasts of Major League Baseball playoffs (since KJR has Huskies and only do "selective" MLB playoffs), Sunday and Monday Nite football and NBA games. KIRO AM would reach a bigger audience w/Fox Sports than KHHO.

[Mike the Driver]

Oh yeah, maybe KVI or KTTH could go to the All Traffic Reports, all the time!

Just like 730 AM in Vancouver BC does. (The old CKLG AM)

I heard it when I was up there cpl years ago, constant traffic reports, ferry reports if delayed, airline flight arrivals that are delayed and how long the wait was at the border crossings.

You think Seattle is ready for that? Or maybe all traffic from 5 to 9 am and from 3 to 7 pm? With some talk in between?

[Mike the Driver]

In regards to the question about "Groz" on KJR having his hours reduced. THey said it wasn't the ratings but a cost cutting move. Well, in the previous couple of years, Groz would be out "sick" alot. Yes he had surgery but after that seemed like you'd tune in and he would be "out today" after a special event he attended. So that could have had an effect on his job at KJR.

Last week, Softy was not on the air and others were filling, including Elise. That nite they had ESPN programming on instead.

Why couldn't one of the other KJR staff fill in from 7 to 10 instead of ESPN? They got Dick Fein, Sandmeyer and others yet none of them could work ?

KJR staff better watch out, be cheaper to put ESPN on at 7 pm and somebody will be out of a job, right Groz?

Coming this fall... another 11 hour day of Fusky Football coverage on KJR that is STUPID!

Softy and his sidekicks talk and talk and talk, maybe they should replay the game and after each play "critique it" LOL

[Ray]

I think the post by Ray | July 30, 2008 at 12:21 PM hit the nail on the head.

When I grew up, AM was all about music and there was no FM. When FM grew roots, AM transitioned to talk and sports.

Having just bought a car with a 3-month XM trial, I've subscribed and will rarely go back to local. As more new cars come equipped with XM/Sirius, there will be fewer and fewer listeners willing to put up with ads.

So the next transition we will see will be to satellite radio and FM, with the better sound quality will take over talk/sports.